The U.S. Department of Justice has reached a preliminary settlement with Boeing in a fraud case stemming from two deadly crashes involving 737 MAX aircraft that killed 346 people. The agreement, which is subject to court approval, will allow Boeing to avoid criminal prosecution.

Without the deal, the trial would begin on June 23. Boeing would then be on trial for misleading U.S. regulators about a key flight control system on the 737 MAX. Two of the planes crashed in 2018 and 2019 in Indonesia and Ethiopia.

In total, Boeing will pay more than $1.1 billion, including fines and punitive damages. $445 million will be spent on improving the company's compliance, safety and quality programs. "We believe this resolution is the most equitable and practical outcome," the department said.

--- DB4 - 20230201
* Origin: AVIATION ECHO HQ (2:292/854)

Aviation HQ wrote to All <=-

The U.S. Department of Justice has reached a preliminary settlement
with Boeing in a fraud case stemming from two deadly crashes involving
737 MAX aircraft that killed 346 people. The agreement, which is
subject to court approval, will allow Boeing to avoid criminal prosecution.

Without the deal, the trial would begin on June 23. Boeing would then
be on trial for misleading U.S. regulators about a key flight control system on the 737 MAX. Two of the planes crashed in 2018 and 2019 in Indonesia and Ethiopia.

In total, Boeing will pay more than $1.1 billion, including fines and punitive damages. $445 million will be spent on improving the company's compliance, safety and quality programs. "We believe this resolution is the most equitable and practical outcome," the department said.

Me and light aircraft get along just fine. Airliners - not so much. I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

... "A sure cure for seasickness is to sit under a tree." -- Spike Milligan
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Hello Dave,

Me and light aircraft get along just fine. Airliners - not so much. I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

Well, that is if there "IS" Amtrack.

The northern line which runs from St.Paul (I think) to somewhere Seattle uses Burlington-Northern tracks where priority if given to freight trains. A full day's delay on arrival is not uncommon.

I once drove a Trailways bus transcontinental from LA to NYC (and other routes). 4 days. Recently I looked into doing it again for fun, busses with wifi etc ... it was costlier than flying 6 hours.

\%/@rd

--- DB4 - 20230201
* Origin: AVIATION ECHO HQ (2:292/854)

Ward Dossche wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Me and light aircraft get along just fine. Airliners - not so much. I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

Well, that is if there "IS" Amtrack.

Passenger rail is down quite a bit from its "hey-day". My first long
distance trip was from Springfield, IL to St. Louis on the GM&O (now/ currently) ATSF. Jumped onto CB&Q's Twin Citiies Express to Faribault,
MN. Along the way motive power and crews weere changed and it became
a Rock Island "Rocket" Bv)=

The northern line which runs from St.Paul (I think) to somewhere
Seattle uses Burlington-Northern tracks where priority if given to
freight trains. A full day's delay on arrival is not uncommon.

I once drove a Trailways bus transcontinental from LA to NYC (and other routes). 4 days. Recently I looked into doing it again for fun, busses with wifi etc ... it was costlier than flying 6 hours.

If I read that right you were aq bus driver???? Hardly ever see passenger busses around here. Greyhound maintains a passenger terminal at a local
auto salvage and towing firm. Trailways has disappearede. Lots of big
charter busses like Windy City Tours.

Last airplane ride I took was from SPI to DCA direct and was a round trip.
The plane was a twin turboprop Fairchild puddle jumper.

... "The barbeque is the root of all civilization." -- Michael Petch
--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Dave,

If I read that right you were aq bus driver???? Hardly ever see passenger busses around here. Greyhound maintains a passenger terminal at a local auto salvage and towing firm. Trailways has disappearede. Lots of big charter busses like Windy City Tours.

No. In 1972 I was in an exchange program not knowing where I was heading to. Just America. Arrived in New York and got a bus ticket to Great Falls Montana. A trailways bus Detroit Chicago Denver SaltLakeCity GreatFalls. There are more direct routes but to keep it cheap I was given a "See America" ticket and made the grand tour. 4 days on a bus, I can write a (small) book about it. Crossing Nebraska end of June was so boring ... there is nothing, just fields with corn as far as the eye reaches.

Also was in a GreatFalls LosAngeles trip, LosAngeles to Detroit and then to New York. Affordable but it takes so much time ... plus all the meals en-route plus drinks ... competes with airlines. But you see a lot, the perfect way to learn how big the USA really is.

\%/@rd

--- DB4 - 20230201
* Origin: AVIATION ECHO HQ (2:292/854)

Re: Boeing buys out of a law
By: Dave Drum to Aviation HQ on Wed May 28 2025 12:35:00

I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

Some years back I took a train from Windsor, Ontario to Toronto. Took about three hours. It was the first time I'd been on a train since I was a wee lad. It was rather enjoyable, but I don't think I'd want to ride any longer than that. For longer trips, I'll take the friendly skies anytime. Did you know it takes the same abount of time to fly to LA as to drive to Cincinnati?
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Re: Planes and Trains
By: Mortar M. to Dave Drum on Sat May 31 2025 23:39:59

Did you know it takes the same abount of time to fly to LA as to drive to Cincinnati?

Oops, I forgot to mention that's starting from Detroit.
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Re: Re: Boeing buys out of a law
By: Ward Dossche to Dave Drum on Thu May 29 2025 13:03:41

I once drove a Trailways bus transcontinental from LA to NYC...4 days.

When did you find time to sleep?
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Re: Re: Boeing buys out of a
By: Dave Drum to Ward Dossche on Fri May 30 2025 01:45:00

Last airplane ride I took was from SPI to DCA...

Can you decypher that?
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

I once drove a Trailways bus transcontinental from LA to NYC...4 days.

When did you find time to sleep?

You slept on the bus as it continued on through the night ,,, it was pretty do-able ... you meet a lot of folks, interesting talks as well.

\%/@rd

--- DB4 - 20230201
* Origin: AVIATION ECHO HQ (2:292/854)

Ward Dossche wrote to Dave Drum <=-

If I read that right you were aq bus driver???? Hardly ever see passenger busses around here. Greyhound maintains a passenger terminal at a local auto salvage and towing firm. Trailways has disappearede. Lots of big charter busses like Windy City Tours.

No. In 1972 I was in an exchange program not knowing where I was
heading to. Just America. Arrived in New York and got a bus ticket to Great Falls Montana. A trailways bus Detroit Chicago Denver
SaltLakeCity GreatFalls. There are more direct routes but to keep it
cheap I was given a "See America" ticket and made the grand tour. 4
days on a bus, I can write a (small) book about it. Crossing Nebraska
end of June was so boring ... there is nothing, just fields with corn
as far as the eye reaches.

Miles and miles of nothing but miles and miles. Bv)=

Also was in a GreatFalls LosAngeles trip, LosAngeles to Detroit and
then to New York. Affordable but it takes so much time ... plus all the meals en-route plus drinks ... competes with airlines. But you see a
lot, the perfect way to learn how big the USA really is.

I've made a few bus long-distance rides. But, truly, I do prefer riding
the rails. The food is better nand there aren't so many smelly, crying infants to "flavour" my journey.

And, as you say - the co$t is about the same.

... January 20, 2025 - Error Redux
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Mortar M. wrote to Dave Drum <=-

I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

Some years back I took a train from Windsor, Ontario to Toronto. Took about three hours. It was the first time I'd been on a train since I
was a wee lad. It was rather enjoyable, but I don't think I'd want to ride any longer than that. For longer trips, I'll take the friendly
skies anytime. Did you know it takes the same abount of time to fly to
LA as to drive to Cincinnati?

Diffr'nt strokes for different folks. I can travel from Springfield, IL
to Chicage in about 3 1/2 hours on the train. And I'm right in the middle
of Chicago when I arrive. If I fly I have to arrange a ride to the aero-
drome or leave my car in long-term parking. Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) I either have to take a cab or airport 'limo"
to a Hotel. or rent a car. IOW about the same or more time and *much*
more hassle.

... If you havewn't grown up by age 50 - you don't have to. -- Uncle Dirty Dave === MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Mortar M. wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Re: Re: Boeing buys out of a
By: Dave Drum to Ward Dossche on Fri May 30 2025 01:45:00

Last airplane ride I took was from SPI to DCA...

Can you decypher that?

SPI = Springfield (Illinois) Capital Airport

DCA = Washington, DC Reagan Airport. Dulles is IAD


... Maybe pigs make themselves tasty because they're altruistic
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) ...

Chicaco Meigs closed in 2003.

Obviously you don't fly a whole lot ...

\%/@rd

--- DB4 - 20230201
* Origin: AVIATION ECHO HQ (2:292/854)

Re: Re: Bussing Cross-country
By: Ward Dossche to Mortar M. on Sun Jun 01 2025 12:34:29

I once drove a Trailways bus transcontinental from LA to NYC...4 days.

-----

You slept on the bus as it continued on through the night...

Bet that made the passengers nervous.
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Ward Dossche wrote to Dave Drum <=-

If I read that right you were aq bus driver???? Hardly ever see passenger busses around here. Greyhound maintains a passenger terminal at a local auto salvage and towing firm. Trailways has disappearede. Lots of big charter busses like Windy City Tours.

No. In 1972 I was in an exchange program not knowing where I was
heading to. Just America. Arrived in New York and got a bus ticket to Great Falls Montana. A trailways bus Detroit Chicago Denver
SaltLakeCity GreatFalls. There are more direct routes but to keep it
cheap I was given a "See America" ticket and made the grand tour. 4
days on a bus, I can write a (small) book about it. Crossing Nebraska
end of June was so boring ... there is nothing, just fields with corn
as far as the eye reaches.

Miles and miles of nothing but miles and miles. Bv)=

Also was in a GreatFalls LosAngeles trip, LosAngeles to Detroit and
then to New York. Affordable but it takes so much time ... plus all the meals en-route plus drinks ... competes with airlines. But you see a
lot, the perfect way to learn how big the USA really is.

I've made a few bus long-distance rides. But, truly, I do prefer riding
the rails. The food is better nand there aren't so many smelly, crying infants to "flavour" my journey.

And, as you say - the co$t is about the same.

... January 20, 2025 - Error Redux
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Mortar M. wrote to Dave Drum <=-

I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

Some years back I took a train from Windsor, Ontario to Toronto. Took about three hours. It was the first time I'd been on a train since I
was a wee lad. It was rather enjoyable, but I don't think I'd want to ride any longer than that. For longer trips, I'll take the friendly
skies anytime. Did you know it takes the same abount of time to fly to
LA as to drive to Cincinnati?

Diffr'nt strokes for different folks. I can travel from Springfield, IL
to Chicage in about 3 1/2 hours on the train. And I'm right in the middle
of Chicago when I arrive. If I fly I have to arrange a ride to the aero-
drome or leave my car in long-term parking. Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) I either have to take a cab or airport 'limo"
to a Hotel. or rent a car. IOW about the same or more time and *much*
more hassle.

... If you havewn't grown up by age 50 - you don't have to. -- Uncle Dirty Dave === MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Mortar M. wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Re: Re: Boeing buys out of a
By: Dave Drum to Ward Dossche on Fri May 30 2025 01:45:00

Last airplane ride I took was from SPI to DCA...

Can you decypher that?

SPI = Springfield (Illinois) Capital Airport

DCA = Washington, DC Reagan Airport. Dulles is IAD


... Maybe pigs make themselves tasty because they're altruistic
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Ward Dossche wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) ...

Chicaco Meigs closed in 2003.

You're right. And Mayor Daley - who sprung that surprise on averyone -
walked all over his wedding tackle with the gold spikes.

Obviously you don't fly a whole lot ...

Just private/general aviation - and with the 5 stents plus the pacemaker
I connot pass my medical to be a pilot any longer. Never did like flying
in to the Windy City.

... Tasty is tasty. Authentic is authentic. Different virtues.
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) ...

Chicaco Meigs closed in 2003.

Obviously you don't fly a whole lot ...

How that one closed is one if the weirdest urban expansion stories I've
heard in a while. IIRC, the mayor wanted the land and couldn't get it
closed "the right way" so, overnight, a bunch of earth-moving equipment showed up and tore X's into the runways.

Some unexpecting pilots had to divert their flights.

Mike

* SLMR 2.1a * About as useful as a chocolate teapot.
--- SBBSecho 3.20-Linux
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Ward Dossche wrote to Dave Drum <=-

If I read that right you were aq bus driver???? Hardly ever see passenger busses around here. Greyhound maintains a passenger terminal at a local auto salvage and towing firm. Trailways has disappearede. Lots of big charter busses like Windy City Tours.

No. In 1972 I was in an exchange program not knowing where I was
heading to. Just America. Arrived in New York and got a bus ticket to Great Falls Montana. A trailways bus Detroit Chicago Denver
SaltLakeCity GreatFalls. There are more direct routes but to keep it
cheap I was given a "See America" ticket and made the grand tour. 4
days on a bus, I can write a (small) book about it. Crossing Nebraska
end of June was so boring ... there is nothing, just fields with corn
as far as the eye reaches.

Miles and miles of nothing but miles and miles. Bv)=

Also was in a GreatFalls LosAngeles trip, LosAngeles to Detroit and
then to New York. Affordable but it takes so much time ... plus all the meals en-route plus drinks ... competes with airlines. But you see a
lot, the perfect way to learn how big the USA really is.

I've made a few bus long-distance rides. But, truly, I do prefer riding
the rails. The food is better nand there aren't so many smelly, crying infants to "flavour" my journey.

And, as you say - the co$t is about the same.

... January 20, 2025 - Error Redux
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Mortar M. wrote to Dave Drum <=-

I prefer Amtrak for long distances. Plus the food is better, too. Bv)=

Some years back I took a train from Windsor, Ontario to Toronto. Took about three hours. It was the first time I'd been on a train since I
was a wee lad. It was rather enjoyable, but I don't think I'd want to ride any longer than that. For longer trips, I'll take the friendly
skies anytime. Did you know it takes the same abount of time to fly to
LA as to drive to Cincinnati?

Diffr'nt strokes for different folks. I can travel from Springfield, IL
to Chicage in about 3 1/2 hours on the train. And I'm right in the middle
of Chicago when I arrive. If I fly I have to arrange a ride to the aero-
drome or leave my car in long-term parking. Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) I either have to take a cab or airport 'limo"
to a Hotel. or rent a car. IOW about the same or more time and *much*
more hassle.

... If you havewn't grown up by age 50 - you don't have to. -- Uncle Dirty Dave === MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Mortar M. wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Re: Re: Boeing buys out of a
By: Dave Drum to Ward Dossche on Fri May 30 2025 01:45:00

Last airplane ride I took was from SPI to DCA...

Can you decypher that?

SPI = Springfield (Illinois) Capital Airport

DCA = Washington, DC Reagan Airport. Dulles is IAD


... Maybe pigs make themselves tasty because they're altruistic
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Ward Dossche wrote to Dave Drum <=-

Thwn when I arrive in Chicago (Midway, O'Hare or Meigs) ...

Chicaco Meigs closed in 2003.

You're right. And Mayor Daley - who sprung that surprise on averyone -
walked all over his wedding tackle with the gold spikes.

Obviously you don't fly a whole lot ...

Just private/general aviation - and with the 5 stents plus the pacemaker
I connot pass my medical to be a pilot any longer. Never did like flying
in to the Windy City.

... Tasty is tasty. Authentic is authentic. Different virtues.
=== MultiMail/Win v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.27-Linux
* Origin: End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com (1:124/5016)

Dave,

Chicaco Meigs closed in 2003.

You're right...

You know ... generally sending a message just once, does the trick.

\%/@rd

--- DB4 - 20230201
* Origin: AVIATION ECHO HQ (2:292/854)