From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 2025-08-17 09:14, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 17/08/2025 13:34, Carlos E.R. wrote:

On 2025-08-16 20:34, Rich wrote:

Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> wrote:

Le 14-08-2025, Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> a écrit :

I've had *bad* luck with Nvidia.

Everyone is experiencing bad luck with Nvidia at a time or another.
Even
Ubuntu for which the drivers are designed has issues during updates
from
time to time.

Twenty five years go, Nvidia was the only way to have a modern graphic >>>> card on Linux. Today, it's the worst.

I've noticed that, mostly, the folks having "issues with Nvidia" also
more often than not overlap with the set of users "who buy the newest
cutting edge thing the moment it arrives in the stores".  In those
instances, and with Linux, yes, it is no wonder they experience "issues
with Nvidia".

I had trouble with Nvidia stopping support of my then old card. I had
to revert to Nouveau.

I think there are drivers for Nvidia going back to the year dot...

Perhaps. But getting them to build and work with more modern kernels
than they were designed for just isn't worth the trouble. Nvidia's
banking on that. Their business model is to "force" you to buy a new
card every so often.

TJ
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From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 2025-08-18, TJ wrote:

On 2025-08-17 09:14, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 17/08/2025 13:34, Carlos E.R. wrote:

On 2025-08-16 20:34, Rich wrote:

Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> wrote:

Le 14-08-2025, Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> a écrit :

I've had *bad* luck with Nvidia.

Everyone is experiencing bad luck with Nvidia at a time or
another. Even
Ubuntu for which the drivers are designed has issues during
updates from
time to time.

Twenty five years go, Nvidia was the only way to have a modern graphic >>>>> card on Linux. Today, it's the worst.

I've noticed that, mostly, the folks having "issues with Nvidia" also
more often than not overlap with the set of users "who buy the newest
cutting edge thing the moment it arrives in the stores".  In those
instances, and with Linux, yes, it is no wonder they experience "issues >>>> with Nvidia".

I had trouble with Nvidia stopping support of my then old card. I
had to revert to Nouveau.

I think there are drivers for Nvidia going back to the year dot...

Perhaps. But getting them to build and work with more modern kernels
than they were designed for just isn't worth the trouble. Nvidia's
banking on that. Their business model is to "force" you to buy a new
card every so often.

Besides the proprietary drivers, doesn't nVidia have people working on
Nouveau too?
--
Nuno Silva
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From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

Ummmmmmm ... WHY are we relying on INTEL to produce
Linux drivers for NVidia ???

Just askin'
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From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

c186282 wrote:

WHY are we relying on INTEL to produce
Linux drivers for NVidia ?

Because Intel does not publish the source code to its drivers and the
exact specifications to its chips, so everything driver-wise will have
to be reverse-engineered, which obviously is a gigantic task that
currently is avoided by using their proprietary drivers.

-jw-
--
And now for something completely different...
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

Joerg Walther <joerg.walther@magenta.de> wrote:

c186282 wrote:

WHY are we relying on INTEL to produce
Linux drivers for NVidia ?

Because Intel does not publish the source code to its drivers

I think they do contribute to the drivers in the Linux kernel which
is what this discussion was all about. Those are, by definition,
open-source. Firmware binaries are another matter.

For Nvidia too, I believe their latest Linux driver efforts, since
2022, are open-source:
https://www.phoronix.com/review/nvidia-open-kernel

Their code is here:
https://github.com/NVIDIA/open-gpu-kernel-modules
--
__ __
#_ < |\| |< _#
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From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 8/18/25 11:22 AM, Joerg Walther wrote:

c186282 wrote:

WHY are we relying on INTEL to produce
Linux drivers for NVidia ?

Because Intel does not publish the source code to its drivers and the
exact specifications to its chips, so everything driver-wise will have
to be reverse-engineered, which obviously is a gigantic task that
currently is avoided by using their proprietary drivers.

Well, as-needed, REVERSE ENGINEER.

The Linux/Unix segment should NOT be dependent
on a commercial entity like Intel. Find good
solutions - open-source, free - or NOT AT ALL.

M$ and others have been working at inserting
SO much of their proprietary code into -IX
that, soon, they will CLAIM OWNERSHIP. IMHO
that IS The Plan. Then -IX goes away ... which
is exactly what they WANT. Colonize, Absorb,
Destroy.
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From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 2025-08-19, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:

M$ and others have been working at inserting
SO much of their proprietary code into -IX
that, soon, they will CLAIM OWNERSHIP. IMHO
that IS The Plan. Then -IX goes away ... which
is exactly what they WANT. Colonize, Absorb,
Destroy.

Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. The first two are the
official marketing slogan of outfits like M$, but
it's the third that they're really after.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | Growth for the sake of
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | growth is the ideology
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | of the cancer cell.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Edward Abbey
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From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 8/19/25 2:46 AM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:

On 2025-08-19, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:

M$ and others have been working at inserting
SO much of their proprietary code into -IX
that, soon, they will CLAIM OWNERSHIP. IMHO
that IS The Plan. Then -IX goes away ... which
is exactly what they WANT. Colonize, Absorb,
Destroy.

Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. The first two are the
official marketing slogan of outfits like M$, but
it's the third that they're really after.

And anyone interested in alt systems NEEDS TO RESIST.
SEE the plan, work AROUND the plan.

Hey, the Chinese can figure out how to work NVidia
chips ... why can't WE ???
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On Tue, 19 Aug 2025 06:46:47 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:

Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. The first two are the official marketing
slogan of outfits like M$, but it's the third that they're really after.

Microsoft tried that first with Linux. Remember “Linux is a cancer”? Remember the “Get The Facts” campaign? Remember the crowing over the fact that the London Stock Exchange picked Windows Server over Linux to run
their mission-critical real-time trading system? Then after that system ignominiously fell apart, they switched to Linux anyway?

“Extinguish” failed. And Windows never recovered from its reputation for unreliability.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 8/19/25 3:19 AM, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:

On Tue, 19 Aug 2025 06:46:47 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:

Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. The first two are the official marketing
slogan of outfits like M$, but it's the third that they're really after.

Microsoft tried that first with Linux. Remember “Linux is a cancer”? Remember the “Get The Facts” campaign? Remember the crowing over the fact that the London Stock Exchange picked Windows Server over Linux to run
their mission-critical real-time trading system? Then after that system ignominiously fell apart, they switched to Linux anyway?

“Extinguish” failed. And Windows never recovered from its reputation for unreliability.

M$ has infinite LAWYERS ... they'll KEEP at it.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

Because Intel does not publish the source code to its drivers

I think they do contribute to the drivers in the Linux kernel which
is what this discussion was all about. Those are, by definition,
open-source. Firmware binaries are another matter.

For Nvidia too, I believe their latest Linux driver efforts, since
2022, are open-source:

Thanks for updating me, I wasn't aware of that. With growing market
shares of Linux things will have to change.

-jw-
--
And now for something completely different...
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 2025-08-19, Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

On Tue, 19 Aug 2025 06:46:47 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:

Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. The first two are the official marketing
slogan of outfits like M$, but it's the third that they're really after.

Microsoft tried that first with Linux. Remember “Linux is a cancer”? Remember the “Get The Facts” campaign? Remember the crowing over the fact
that the London Stock Exchange picked Windows Server over Linux to run
their mission-critical real-time trading system? Then after that system ignominiously fell apart, they switched to Linux anyway?

Then there was the TCO fiasco. It didn't take long for people to prove
that the total cost of ownership of a Linux system was less than that of
a Windows system. Funny how you don't hear M$ going on about TCO anymore.

“Extinguish” failed. And Windows never recovered from its reputation for unreliability.

I should hope not. They've been building that reputation for over 40
years. Their quality criteria are: "Sort of works, most of the time."
If that's good enough for them, it should be good enough for you.
Or so they say.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | Growth for the sake of
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | growth is the ideology
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | of the cancer cell.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Edward Abbey
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.misc

On 2025-08-14, Robert Heller wrote:

At Thu, 14 Aug 2025 16:52:15 +0100 The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

On 14/08/2025 13:59, John McCue wrote:

rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

[...]

I've always favored AMD and my newest boxes are Ryzen 7s. With
Intel seemingly trying to commit suicide in a very messy fashion
I wouldn't buy a new machine with 'Intel Inside'.

Yes, if I ever buy new, it would be an AMD. And no Nvidia :)

Horses fopr courses. Ive had good luck with Nvidia. Mt friend at the
bleeding edge of mathematical computation, says Intel is the only chip
that has some advanced vector instructions or something .
I am getting fond of ARM base Pis.
Now I know not to expect too much beyond low price

I've had *bad* luck with Nvidia. I have no need for their semi-closed driver
(I don't really need the accel -- I almost exclusively use only xterms), but had issues with the open source drivers as well as issues with things like the
ethernet driver on the AMD motherboard (which had a Nvidia chipset).

I've started seeing at least one website that *demands* webgl. Of course
the website (webapp?) could just have proper fallbacks in place, but:
how are things if one wants to enable webgl without hardware
acceleration? Is that doable? Is it practical?

Since my AMD motherboard died (after over 10 years of more or less continious
operation), I got a Raspberry Pi5. To replace the x86_64's guts it would cost
3x+ what I paided for the Raspberry Pi5, complete with power supply and 256G SSD. Basically I "replaced" a x86_64 ATX tower system with a Raspberry Pi5.
About $100 for the complete Raspberry Pi5, vs *at least* $300 to replace the x86_64 ATX system: cheapest Intel desktop processor: $100, cheapest ATX moderboard $100, plus RAM for the motherboard (unknown, but guessing at least
$100) -- the case, power supply (fairly recently replaced), and disks from the
old system are still good.

Yeah, I can imagine. I for one would prefer to have more computing power
for compilation, but the space-saving and power-saving nature of a
smaller system, besides the price tag, probably shouldn't be overlooked.

(But to be fair I haven't checked what's the computing power available
nowadays in such smaller devices, maybe it already allows heaver CPU
usage of that kind?)
--
Nuno Silva
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