From Newsgroup: comp.sys.mac.apps

-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:

On 7/19/24 11:09 PM, Andrew wrote:

"Meanwhile, all of those benefits are available on Android and have been
since Google introduced the idea of an AI-first smartphone in October 2024 >> during the Pixel 8 launch. With Google's Pixel 9 family due to be announced >> in August, Apple's iPhone will be two generations behind Android's AI
efforts before it has even left the Cupertino stage."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/ewanspence/2024/07/18/apple-iphone-16-pro-max-apple-intelligence-ai-sales-demand-new-iphone/

What do you expect from a company whose advertising budget dwarfs R&D.

But how does it actually matter how far someone is "behind" when the
shiny new widget still isn't all that great, and doesn't actually
reliably provide meaningful productivity gains?

Case in point, AI asked to render salmon swimming upstream:

<https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/yijd3c/they_asked_an_ai_engine_to_recreate_a_salmon/>

-hh

That’s what salmon looks like at the grocery store!

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Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

On 2024-07-20 07:07, -hh wrote:

<https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/yijd3c/they_asked_an_ai_engine_to_recreate_a_salmon/>

Perfect.

In early AI experiments (80's) they asked a computer to come up with a description of the suburbs.

It spat out: "... a place where grass is grown."

Earlier this year Google had several blunders, notably the one where it was asked to create a picture of a bunch of Englishman.

It’s just another example of Garbage In Garbage Out and wokism.

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Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

badgolferman wrote on Sat, 20 Jul 2024 15:04:28 -0000 (UTC) :

<https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/yijd3c/they_asked_an_ai_engine_to_recreate_a_salmon/>

Perfect.

In early AI experiments (80's) they asked a computer to come up with a
description of the suburbs.

It spat out: "... a place where grass is grown."

Earlier this year Google had several blunders, notably the one where it was >> asked to create a picture of a bunch of Englishman.

Itขs just another example of Garbage In Garbage Out and wokism.

While I'm no fan of silly gimmicks (such as what AI appears to mostly be), for Apple to be two generations behind Google is usually considered bad.

That depends on if Google is actually moving in the correct direction.

You have to ask why Apple is two generations behind Google (who is not standing still), where it's the same question to ask why Apple is something like five generations behind Qualcomm on 5G modem design (who also isn't standing still).

But Apple is using the best 5G chips, because they’re buying them from Qualcomm. Do keep in mind that not every last component has to strictly be created & fabbed in-house.

Why is Apple consistently behind on almost all emergent smartphone tech? Could it be because Apple doesn't actually spend (for its size) in R&D?

Or it could be just Apple’s standards for approving a commercial product to ship are higher than their peers.

-hh

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Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

-hh wrote on Sat, 20 Jul 2024 22:01:25 -0400 :

Apple has a tendency to come in "late" and leapfrog
everyone else with a much better version. When the iPhone was
released, everyone else had to quickly play catch-up and lazily
copied the iPhone (and many still do) with a sub-quality knock-off.

Pretty much what I was alluding to: having an “early lead” to market when
the tech change hasn´t adequately matured isn´t really worth that much: >>
thus, it is far wiser to let it continue to mature without putting its
warts out on public display where it can only created a poor opinion of it: >> use that developmental time to find where it actually makes a difference
(eg productivity) before commercially launching it .. which is yes, pretty >> typical of how Apple tends to operate.

It's interesting how biased the ignorant uneducated low-IQ Apple religious zealots are; but let's simply ask them to back up their claims by stating even a *single* factual technological accomplishment Apple has had for the iPhone in the past five years that they consider "leapfrogged" Android.

Name just one.
We'll wait...

Non sequitur.

Because what is the origin of this claim that Apple can only be successful
in the marketplace if they do nothing less than “leapfrogging”?

HINT: These uneducated low-IQ religious zealots just make this stuff up.

Which is why I asked you for a substantiating citation of what you’re
trying to use as a goalpost: due diligence requires that you didn’t try to disingenuously move said goalposts.

-hh

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Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

-hh wrote on Sat, 20 Jul 2024 22:01:25 -0400 :

Apple has a tendency to come in "late" and leapfrog
everyone else with a much better version. When the iPhone was
released, everyone else had to quickly play catch-up and lazily
copied the iPhone (and many still do) with a sub-quality knock-off.

Pretty much what I was alluding to: having an “early lead” to market when
the tech change hasn´t adequately matured isn´t really worth that much: >>
thus, it is far wiser to let it continue to mature without putting its
warts out on public display where it can only created a poor opinion of it: >> use that developmental time to find where it actually makes a difference
(eg productivity) before commercially launching it .. which is yes, pretty >> typical of how Apple tends to operate.

It's interesting how biased the ignorant uneducated low-IQ Apple religious zealots are; but let's simply ask them to back up their claims by stating even a *single* factual technological accomplishment Apple has had for the iPhone in the past five years that they consider "leapfrogged" Android.

Name just one.
We'll wait...

HINT: These uneducated low-IQ religious zealots just make this stuff up.

AirTags?

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Bud Frede <frede@mouse-potato.com> wrote:

badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> writes:

Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

On 2024-07-20 07:07, -hh wrote:

<https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/yijd3c/they_asked_an_ai_engine_to_recreate_a_salmon/>

Perfect.

In early AI experiments (80's) they asked a computer to come up with a
description of the suburbs.

It spat out: "... a place where grass is grown."

Earlier this year Google had several blunders, notably the one where it was >> asked to create a picture of a bunch of Englishman.

It’s just another example of Garbage In Garbage Out and wokism.

Please keep your politics out of it. Thank you.

The myriad of articles describing the issue specifically pointed out the
reason behind the Google AI search results and it was as I described.

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badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote:

Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

.

It's interesting how biased the ignorant uneducated low-IQ Apple religious >> zealots are; but let's simply ask them to back up their claims by stating
even a *single* factual technological accomplishment Apple has had for the >> iPhone in the past five years that they consider "leapfrogged" Android.

Name just one.
We'll wait...

HINT: These uneducated low-IQ religious zealots just make this stuff up.

AirTags?

Yup. Nothing comes close.

Not in the last five years, that's quite short period of time in such a
mature industry, but also AirPods (& Pros) and FaceID.



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Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

badgolferman wrote on Sun, 21 Jul 2024 09:50:47 -0000 (UTC) :

AirTags are the standard tracking device right now. The Android version
still has a long way to go.

https://www.tomsguide.com/phones/google-pixel-phones/an-unofficial-test-compared-apples-airtags-against-googles-find-my-device-heres-which-tracker-won

Hi badgolferman,

Please never forget I'm not stupid. Give me credit for being intelligent.

And yet you don't acknowledge that badgolferman has come up with a good example.

Prior to AirTags the market leader was Tile. Now Tile are struggling to be relevant. The android solutions are desperate to join Apple's Find My
network.

I think you misunderstood what I said

Everyone understands your one-sided, factless rhetoric.

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Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

Chris wrote on Mon, 22 Jul 2024 07:29:01 -0000 (UTC) :

Please never forget I'm not stupid. Give me credit for being intelligent. >>

And yet you don't acknowledge that badgolferman has come up with a good
example.

I'm going to converse with you as if you own normal adult cognition, OK?

Look again. I told badgolferman right away that he was the only one who suggested *anything* that the iPhone "leapfrogged" Android. I feted him.

However, I also note that AirTags are NOT an iPhone feature; so we're still waiting for even a single iPhone feature that leapfrogged that of Android.

badgolfernan has already convinced of your misconception so I'll refer you
to him.

Q: Name a single iPhone feature that you believe "leapfrogged" Android.
A: ?

To repeat as you ignored it last time: AirPods (+ Pros) and FaceID. Android equivalents for the airpods have since caught up, mostly, but not FaceID. There's also the Automation/ShortCuts feature which doesn't have an
equivalent in android and includes the Geofencing functionality which you lauded didn't exist.

Plus iphone security is currently uncrackable by the popular cracking tool
used by both law enforcement and others willing to pay the high fees: https://www.techspot.com/news/103880-cellebrite-tools-cant-crack-iphones-running-ios-174.html

Android doesn't fare quite so well. For example, the Trump shooter had his Samsung phone cracked: https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/techandscience/the-fbi-got-into-the-trump-rally-shooter-s-phone-in-just-40-minutes/ar-BB1qhMgY

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Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

Chris wrote on Mon, 22 Jul 2024 18:31:21 -0000 (UTC) :

Q: Name a single iPhone feature that you believe "leapfrogged" Android.
A: ?

To repeat as you ignored it last time: AirPods (+ Pros) and FaceID. Android >> equivalents for the airpods have since caught up, mostly, but not FaceID.

Unfortunately for you, for you to claim FaceID is anything but a (rather brilliant) mere marketing gimmick is not going to sit well with me, since I am well aware why Apple customers *need* such a gimmick

I *knew* you would go down this rabbit hole.

Need is utterly irrelevant to your question. The fact is biometrics are commonly used by mobile phone users and FaceID is easily more advanced than other facial recognition methods available.

Besides, even Android has the same garbage gimmick.

I agree that the android version is garbage.

There's also the Automation/ShortCuts feature which doesn't have an
equivalent in android and includes the Geofencing functionality which you
lauded didn't exist.

This is absurd. The automation on Android far surpasses anything on Apple. I'm not even going to go there as you're desperate at this point.

Because you can't. You didn't even know it existed on ios so you don't know what you're talking about. Again.

Plus iphone security is currently uncrackable by the popular cracking tool >> used by both law enforcement and others willing to pay the high fees:
https://www.techspot.com/news/103880-cellebrite-tools-cant-crack-iphones-running-ios-174.html

Jesus Christ. You fall for every marketing gimmick in the book, Chris.
Do you know the iPhone is far more exploited than Android, Chris?
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>

That link doesn't confirm what you think it does. As was demonstrated to
you.

Do you realize that Android security for dozens of core modules is updated monthly for every Android 10 device on the Internet while iOS is not?

It's not all of them, though, is it? The rest of the os is completely vulnerable. To the joy of the likes of cellebrite.

Do you even realize that Pegasus often infects the iOS kernel and yet it
has NEVER been able to infect the Android kernel, Chris.

Pegasus targets high value individuals. *That's* why it doesn't target
android ;)

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Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

On 2024-07-31 05:50:03 +0000, candycanearter07 said:

Yeah, I personally dislike AI.

As far as I can find, the only people who actually like AI are those
making money from creating it or pointlessly adding it to every product
they sell to get gullible to upgrade yet again. :-\

In the chess and backgammon worlds, AI or the neural net as it used to be called, has long since overtaken any human player and are looked upon as
the standard when it comes to analyzing moves.

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Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

On 2024-07-31 05:50:03 +0000, candycanearter07 said:

-hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote at 02:01 this Sunday (GMT):

Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

On 2024-07-20 11:07:59 +0000, -hh said:

On 7/19/24 11:09 PM, Andrew wrote:

"Meanwhile, all of those benefits are available on Android and have been >>>>>> since Google introduced the idea of an AI-first smartphone in October 2024
during the Pixel 8 launch. With Google's Pixel 9 family due to be announced
in August, Apple's iPhone will be two generations behind Android's AI >>>>>> efforts before it has even left the Cupertino stage."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/ewanspence/2024/07/18/apple-iphone-16-pro-max-apple-intelligence-ai-sales-demand-new-iphone/




What do you expect from a company whose advertising budget dwarfs R&D. >>>>>

But how does it actually matter how far someone is "behind" when the >>>>> shiny new widget still isn't all that great, and doesn't actually
reliably provide meaningful productivity gains?
uttinf
Case in point, AI asked to render salmon swimming upstream:


<https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/yijd3c/they_asked_an_ai_engine_to_recreate_a_salmon/>

Ignoring the fact that AI is utterly useless and nothing more than
another fad gimmick ...

Well, it may be a fad .. or perhaps not (at least for certain niches).
Real point is that it is still formative and immature today.

[snip]

Yeah, I personally dislike AI.

As far as I can find, the only people who actually like AI are those
making money from creating it or pointlessly adding it to every product
they sell to get gullible to upgrade yet again. :-\

"AI" has so many different meanings that it depends on who you ask.

Most "AI" is some form of statistical modelling - ML, ANN, DL, CNN - which
has been around for decades and is very powerful & useful. In the right context.

Trying to disentangle real AI - oxymoron? - versus snakeoil "AI" is tricky. Even in the scientific community there's little distinction by the funders, propagating the uncertainty.

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